What a great post for today, Asha. I’m so glad your lived experience can enlighten us all, even though I know it was a challenge for you. America really is diverse and fascinating, and I hope we are moving towards more understanding rather than going backwards. You are a brilliant beacon.
You know, I never thought of the perspective of Indian-Americans regarding the inaccurate description of Native Americans / Indigenous People as "Indians". As always, valuable insight. Even before accurate descriptions became part of the common lexicon, it made no sense to me how in modern times, the term "Indian" became interchangeable between two vastly distinct and different groups in terms of geographic and cultural aspects. It is simply sloppy and incorrect terminology, but of course beyond that ignorant, arrogant, and other negatives that would have Trumpers classify me as "liberal" (they LOVE labels for the simplicity and convenience in a world that is not simple nor convenient). As a kid, I tagged along with my older brother to coin and stamp shows held at a VFW post once a month. He was into coins, but the stamps were what grabbed me due to the art and a fascination with geography and the world. I would introduce the world of stamp collecting to kids as it instills an interest in history and geography learned in a fun visual manner. Strangely enough, one of the interesting stamps that comes to mind as I write this is one from approximately 1974 if memory serves me correctly. It is a "block" set that is Indira Gandi speaking to Leonid Brezhnev on the hotline, and this of course very simply illustrates how India was non-aligned. The artistry is indelible, and it made an impact on me. Beyond that, it sets an understanding of history that one should know in order to understand somewhat geopolitical relations. Indeed, it made sixth grade a joy as I learned more about the history in the classroom, and got more perspective. One problem that Americans are often accused of is having a provincial and narrow outlook as many have not traveled abroad. An article I read recently by a British traveler discussed one reason for this, and it is because our country is so vast and varied, many of us can get our need for adventure satisfied close to home or without a passport. I liked that explanation because it wasn't the typical criticism of "Americans are fat and lazy"....my gosh, we are so varied, that is such a sweeping generalization that is ignorant in and of itself. Regarding the theme of Asha's commentary, its a bit of the "whatever" and, ugh, dare I say "brown people" attitude some have at just lumping people together indifferently with an elitist attitude. People like Dan Snyder can be the "whatever" types who fear a sports team name change from something outrageously offensive and insensitive to something civilized, modern, and decent will be submitting to the "woke". I can't understand why being "woke" is necessarily a bad thing.....I mean, do you want to sleepwalk through life? Hah, of all people I think of, it is the antagonist of the film "Animal House" Dean Vernon Wormer who says it best: "Fat, drunk and stupid is no way to go through life my son." I may be working on the first a little, but drunk and stupid are things I try to avoid at all costs. I want to be sentient to all the pleasure, and that includes the necessary occasional pain we all must suffer to appreciate that pleasure. Civilization has evolved through mental and spiritual growth, not regressive "Great Again" nostalgia for moving backwards. So "Happy Indigenous People Day" to all. With all due respect to Italians in particular who consider the holiday somewhat sacred, Columbus Day is a mattress sale holiday, and those of Italian heritage can do better for a heroic holiday. We owe Native Americans our gratitude and some time to pause and reflect on how they have been treated.
Thank you Asha, a very unique look into the life of an immigrant family. I had forgotten the question, “dot or feather”. I appreciate your interesting and informative writing, especially the Latino view of sub continent folk.
I remember an article in the Reader's Digest in the early 70s. The author, a tourist visiting America described his exchange with a Native American chief in a reservation in Arizona. After trying to explain to the chief who he was, the chief summarized it as this: "Columbus was looking for you but he found me."
Being a norwegian, and knowing that my ancestors were the first to encounter the people of the new world, i’m ashamed that they called them “scralings”. I think indians was a kinder name, but i see your plight.
What a pain Asha. I am beginning to think "Lost" men are the bain of all of us. Kidding not kidding We now know the frontal cortex of the female brain is ever so much capable of leadership. Perhaps the world will one day recognize that fact, so we can guide our lost souls to a better world with more humanity.
The world is full of words and beliefs that are so mind boggling. The study and practice of removing false words and beliefs takes time and mostly dedication.
Thanks for the very well written article Asha and the perspective it provides on the substantial difference between 'REAL INDIAN AND NATIVE INDIAN' if I may say so. Its just the reality and the Indian American could never afford to get tired of explaining the difference between the two and I am sure we'd all do so too. Differences in perception in the minds of those who do not belong to either category do take time to pepper over and that would happen with the passage of time and better understanding. As long as there is no colored judgement or prejudice that would be caused for or against either of the communities as a result of confusing one with the other we could simply accept the reality as it exists. Over time the bulk of the populace and society would become more enlightened. That said, the great thing about Americans is the intellectual curiosity they have and the desire to learn truth for what they really are on just about anything. The need to explain things properly is of absolute importance.
There is something else which may be particularly relevant here and which is perhaps besides the point. Nevertheless --the second generation American Indians and the ones following are even more conscious of their unique racial identity and may be even proud and so more sensitive to such misunderstanding than the first generation immigrant of which I am one though there is nothing wrong about it in itself. Wish you well and do look forward to your further interesting perspectives.
Lynne Westercamp ( a history professor) argued that the term came from Columbus describing the Tainos as living "With God"--which in the 15th century Spanish was translated into "en dios." Columbus then started calling the Tainos "Endians," which may havebeen erroneously changed to "Indian" at some point thereafter. Professor Westercamp showed us overhead reproductions of Columbus' journal which seemed to support her claim. Kirkpatrick Sale also mentions this in his book "Conquest of Paradise," and Bartolome De Las Casas seems to refer to it in his "History of the Indies." So, if makes you feel any better, you can say it's due to a misunderstanding of an entry from Columbus' journal. Does that make you feel any better? :-)
Yes, I have been teaching that to my high school students for years. I know not all historians agree, but I think it's important that students be exposed to other historical views. History--particularly in high school--can be pretty monolithic. I think it becomes much more interesting if students get a chance to see other perspectives. So we read from Columbus' journal, we read Las Casas, we learn about Enrique's Uprising--but I don't use the Prager U material...
..<><>.. Kid's are "mean" Ms.Asha maybe You felt hurt or anger growing up! It certainly does not show in Your life as I have read Ur' words or watched Ur' reporting....did You have siblings??
Well, in Ur' Teens i imagine You wore feathers in Ya hair, or dangling as ear rings and proudly displayed Ur' heritage Dot, and as well always challenging Ya Dad's discipline! Thank You for sharing and doing it in a nice Christopher
Columbus story Ms.Asha.... wAc @AshaRangappa @CrowBwell9
“Sharing and understanding these distinct histories is what weaves us together as one nation on the other side of the hyphen.“ Nicely put. Many of us have (& more of us in the future will have) multiple hyphens in our ethnic histories if not identities, & that is how it has always been.
My grandparents were Indians from 2 different tribes (Sioux and Kiowa) that did not get along with each tribe, my mother married an American, my grandmother used to talk about that when I was young, I practically forgot about it all. That was some good reading Asha, thank you
Thank you so much for writing this, Asha! I completely agree with everything you said. As someone who is also of Indian American descent (my grandparents immigrated here in the 1950s, so I'm third generation!), this whole identity mixup/confusion has irritated me to no end since I was in elementary school.
Growing up in Arizona in the early 90's was an awkward experience. When I was asked to explain where I was from, the kids were confused, saying that I was "from Indiana?". Then, in second grade, a Native American dance group (who were talented, by the way) performed at a school assembly, and a group of my classmates told me to get up on stage and dance with them because I was "Indian too." Then came the idiotic racist dot or feather jokes. Why can't these racist idiots realize that not every Indian person is Hindu and that we're a group of people spanning many different cultures?
This identity confusion didn't stop with my childhood as it endured into adulthood. A few years back, when I was part of a Facebook group dedicated to screenwriting and the subject started by an Indian gentleman innocuously asking if the largely non-South Asian group liked Indian movies, then a large number of idiot white guys proceeded to turn it into a joke listing Dances With Wolves and many Native American-themed movies. I politely told the offending posters to knock it off and stick to the subject, but they piled on their bullying telling me to take a joke.
It has frustrated me since I was a kid that we, the people of India, have such a rich, ancient history of many different religions and cultures. Then, part of our identity in American history is to be confused and share the term "Indian" with an unrelated group of people on the other side of the world all because of an idiot explorer who couldn't be bothered to be corrected, and the confusion still exists to this day, sadly.
Our families hail from the second most populous country in the world and one of the oldest civilizations ever, and we have to explain what "kind of Indian" we are?
Seriously, it is truly silly that the US lumps together over 60% of the world’s population as “Asian.” It is a holdover from early British colonialism when people were divided into “white, black, brown, yellow, and red.” We just say “white, African-American, Hispanic, Asian, and Native American.”
My daughter was in a Brownie ceremony where they were supposed to honor diversity and they lit five candles - care to guess what colors?
Hawaii tried to change that by labelling Polynesians “Pacific Islanders” instead of Asian (actually they wanted either to be labeled separately or as native Americans) - so what was the formal response? “AAPI” - Asian-American and Pacific Islanders.
And there is NO way to say that you are mixed. We formally do not acknowledge such categories. Look at Trump’s apparent confusion (or prejudice) about Kamala Harris’ self-identification.
Your children’s ancestors were from India. My late husband’s ancestors were Swiss Germans. If people are interested in your background, that’s the correct answer. But they are not Indian, any more than my husband was Swiss German.
We will never get over racial discrimination until we quit putting people into one of five boxes. Period.
What a great post for today, Asha. I’m so glad your lived experience can enlighten us all, even though I know it was a challenge for you. America really is diverse and fascinating, and I hope we are moving towards more understanding rather than going backwards. You are a brilliant beacon.
You know, I never thought of the perspective of Indian-Americans regarding the inaccurate description of Native Americans / Indigenous People as "Indians". As always, valuable insight. Even before accurate descriptions became part of the common lexicon, it made no sense to me how in modern times, the term "Indian" became interchangeable between two vastly distinct and different groups in terms of geographic and cultural aspects. It is simply sloppy and incorrect terminology, but of course beyond that ignorant, arrogant, and other negatives that would have Trumpers classify me as "liberal" (they LOVE labels for the simplicity and convenience in a world that is not simple nor convenient). As a kid, I tagged along with my older brother to coin and stamp shows held at a VFW post once a month. He was into coins, but the stamps were what grabbed me due to the art and a fascination with geography and the world. I would introduce the world of stamp collecting to kids as it instills an interest in history and geography learned in a fun visual manner. Strangely enough, one of the interesting stamps that comes to mind as I write this is one from approximately 1974 if memory serves me correctly. It is a "block" set that is Indira Gandi speaking to Leonid Brezhnev on the hotline, and this of course very simply illustrates how India was non-aligned. The artistry is indelible, and it made an impact on me. Beyond that, it sets an understanding of history that one should know in order to understand somewhat geopolitical relations. Indeed, it made sixth grade a joy as I learned more about the history in the classroom, and got more perspective. One problem that Americans are often accused of is having a provincial and narrow outlook as many have not traveled abroad. An article I read recently by a British traveler discussed one reason for this, and it is because our country is so vast and varied, many of us can get our need for adventure satisfied close to home or without a passport. I liked that explanation because it wasn't the typical criticism of "Americans are fat and lazy"....my gosh, we are so varied, that is such a sweeping generalization that is ignorant in and of itself. Regarding the theme of Asha's commentary, its a bit of the "whatever" and, ugh, dare I say "brown people" attitude some have at just lumping people together indifferently with an elitist attitude. People like Dan Snyder can be the "whatever" types who fear a sports team name change from something outrageously offensive and insensitive to something civilized, modern, and decent will be submitting to the "woke". I can't understand why being "woke" is necessarily a bad thing.....I mean, do you want to sleepwalk through life? Hah, of all people I think of, it is the antagonist of the film "Animal House" Dean Vernon Wormer who says it best: "Fat, drunk and stupid is no way to go through life my son." I may be working on the first a little, but drunk and stupid are things I try to avoid at all costs. I want to be sentient to all the pleasure, and that includes the necessary occasional pain we all must suffer to appreciate that pleasure. Civilization has evolved through mental and spiritual growth, not regressive "Great Again" nostalgia for moving backwards. So "Happy Indigenous People Day" to all. With all due respect to Italians in particular who consider the holiday somewhat sacred, Columbus Day is a mattress sale holiday, and those of Italian heritage can do better for a heroic holiday. We owe Native Americans our gratitude and some time to pause and reflect on how they have been treated.
Thank you Asha, a very unique look into the life of an immigrant family. I had forgotten the question, “dot or feather”. I appreciate your interesting and informative writing, especially the Latino view of sub continent folk.
The problem starts “what are you” not “who are you?”.
I remember an article in the Reader's Digest in the early 70s. The author, a tourist visiting America described his exchange with a Native American chief in a reservation in Arizona. After trying to explain to the chief who he was, the chief summarized it as this: "Columbus was looking for you but he found me."
😂
Being a norwegian, and knowing that my ancestors were the first to encounter the people of the new world, i’m ashamed that they called them “scralings”. I think indians was a kinder name, but i see your plight.
What a pain Asha. I am beginning to think "Lost" men are the bain of all of us. Kidding not kidding We now know the frontal cortex of the female brain is ever so much capable of leadership. Perhaps the world will one day recognize that fact, so we can guide our lost souls to a better world with more humanity.
The world is full of words and beliefs that are so mind boggling. The study and practice of removing false words and beliefs takes time and mostly dedication.
Thanks for the very well written article Asha and the perspective it provides on the substantial difference between 'REAL INDIAN AND NATIVE INDIAN' if I may say so. Its just the reality and the Indian American could never afford to get tired of explaining the difference between the two and I am sure we'd all do so too. Differences in perception in the minds of those who do not belong to either category do take time to pepper over and that would happen with the passage of time and better understanding. As long as there is no colored judgement or prejudice that would be caused for or against either of the communities as a result of confusing one with the other we could simply accept the reality as it exists. Over time the bulk of the populace and society would become more enlightened. That said, the great thing about Americans is the intellectual curiosity they have and the desire to learn truth for what they really are on just about anything. The need to explain things properly is of absolute importance.
There is something else which may be particularly relevant here and which is perhaps besides the point. Nevertheless --the second generation American Indians and the ones following are even more conscious of their unique racial identity and may be even proud and so more sensitive to such misunderstanding than the first generation immigrant of which I am one though there is nothing wrong about it in itself. Wish you well and do look forward to your further interesting perspectives.
Lynne Westercamp ( a history professor) argued that the term came from Columbus describing the Tainos as living "With God"--which in the 15th century Spanish was translated into "en dios." Columbus then started calling the Tainos "Endians," which may havebeen erroneously changed to "Indian" at some point thereafter. Professor Westercamp showed us overhead reproductions of Columbus' journal which seemed to support her claim. Kirkpatrick Sale also mentions this in his book "Conquest of Paradise," and Bartolome De Las Casas seems to refer to it in his "History of the Indies." So, if makes you feel any better, you can say it's due to a misunderstanding of an entry from Columbus' journal. Does that make you feel any better? :-)
Interesting!
Yes, I have been teaching that to my high school students for years. I know not all historians agree, but I think it's important that students be exposed to other historical views. History--particularly in high school--can be pretty monolithic. I think it becomes much more interesting if students get a chance to see other perspectives. So we read from Columbus' journal, we read Las Casas, we learn about Enrique's Uprising--but I don't use the Prager U material...
..<><>.. Kid's are "mean" Ms.Asha maybe You felt hurt or anger growing up! It certainly does not show in Your life as I have read Ur' words or watched Ur' reporting....did You have siblings??
Well, in Ur' Teens i imagine You wore feathers in Ya hair, or dangling as ear rings and proudly displayed Ur' heritage Dot, and as well always challenging Ya Dad's discipline! Thank You for sharing and doing it in a nice Christopher
Columbus story Ms.Asha.... wAc @AshaRangappa @CrowBwell9
“Sharing and understanding these distinct histories is what weaves us together as one nation on the other side of the hyphen.“ Nicely put. Many of us have (& more of us in the future will have) multiple hyphens in our ethnic histories if not identities, & that is how it has always been.
My grandparents were Indians from 2 different tribes (Sioux and Kiowa) that did not get along with each tribe, my mother married an American, my grandmother used to talk about that when I was young, I practically forgot about it all. That was some good reading Asha, thank you
So will written, Asha. I’m glad to learn more about your experiences. “Dot or feather” made me smile.
Thank you so much for writing this, Asha! I completely agree with everything you said. As someone who is also of Indian American descent (my grandparents immigrated here in the 1950s, so I'm third generation!), this whole identity mixup/confusion has irritated me to no end since I was in elementary school.
Growing up in Arizona in the early 90's was an awkward experience. When I was asked to explain where I was from, the kids were confused, saying that I was "from Indiana?". Then, in second grade, a Native American dance group (who were talented, by the way) performed at a school assembly, and a group of my classmates told me to get up on stage and dance with them because I was "Indian too." Then came the idiotic racist dot or feather jokes. Why can't these racist idiots realize that not every Indian person is Hindu and that we're a group of people spanning many different cultures?
This identity confusion didn't stop with my childhood as it endured into adulthood. A few years back, when I was part of a Facebook group dedicated to screenwriting and the subject started by an Indian gentleman innocuously asking if the largely non-South Asian group liked Indian movies, then a large number of idiot white guys proceeded to turn it into a joke listing Dances With Wolves and many Native American-themed movies. I politely told the offending posters to knock it off and stick to the subject, but they piled on their bullying telling me to take a joke.
It has frustrated me since I was a kid that we, the people of India, have such a rich, ancient history of many different religions and cultures. Then, part of our identity in American history is to be confused and share the term "Indian" with an unrelated group of people on the other side of the world all because of an idiot explorer who couldn't be bothered to be corrected, and the confusion still exists to this day, sadly.
Our families hail from the second most populous country in the world and one of the oldest civilizations ever, and we have to explain what "kind of Indian" we are?
Try “East Indian” descent (worked for a student).
Seriously, it is truly silly that the US lumps together over 60% of the world’s population as “Asian.” It is a holdover from early British colonialism when people were divided into “white, black, brown, yellow, and red.” We just say “white, African-American, Hispanic, Asian, and Native American.”
My daughter was in a Brownie ceremony where they were supposed to honor diversity and they lit five candles - care to guess what colors?
Hawaii tried to change that by labelling Polynesians “Pacific Islanders” instead of Asian (actually they wanted either to be labeled separately or as native Americans) - so what was the formal response? “AAPI” - Asian-American and Pacific Islanders.
And there is NO way to say that you are mixed. We formally do not acknowledge such categories. Look at Trump’s apparent confusion (or prejudice) about Kamala Harris’ self-identification.
Your children’s ancestors were from India. My late husband’s ancestors were Swiss Germans. If people are interested in your background, that’s the correct answer. But they are not Indian, any more than my husband was Swiss German.
We will never get over racial discrimination until we quit putting people into one of five boxes. Period.